[News Importer]

It never seems to amuse me, even having graduated that schools haven’t yet caught on to this Windows 7 thing. I heard it’s pretty good.

Seriously now, let’s consider the fact that the Operating System is now 9 years old, and that it’s ancient technology that Microsoft doesn’t even support anymore. Even more so the fact that over 90% of schools are still using older software, such as Office 2003. While I can’t say it was easy for businesses to adopt it, Microsoft seems to have nailed it on the head, whereas Education still isn’t moving in the same direction. According to NetworkWorld, 9% of business already have adopted Windows 7, 25% plan to adopt Windows 7 in the first half or 2010 and 65% will have it rolled out by the end of 2010. That’s good to know, but what about education.

We continue to talk about the future of technology in education, yet most IT guys in School Districts and Counties (here in the U.S.) haven’t even considered that “Hey, Windows 7 is better then Windows XP, let’s get in on that”. While I can’t blame some people for the costs that would be involved to do a infrastructure upgrade for the network, but the cost of Windows 7 saves you money in the end, no natter what way you look at it. Moreso, Office 2010 is around the corner, and it might be a good idea to opt-in for it if you haven’t already gotten Office 2007, and continue to run Office 2003.


The Underlying Problem
While many tend to overlook the fact that some institutions have made some progress, it isn’t enough to say that it’s a statistic. Colleges seem to be on the right track, or so it seems, but when you look at K-12 schools, they still got a long way to go before they get where they need to be.

So what’s the problem? Cost is a major contributing factor. Granted, not every school district/county is rich, but if you’re going to have a “Technology of the future” program, please, do us a favor and do something about that.


The Solution
While I don’t want to say overhaul your entire ecosystem, upgrading your PCs with new computers, or new-ish computers that support the latest and greatest is a good start. There is 1 solution that can help you transition from Windows XP to Windows Vista, and that’s XP Mode, which works in conjunction with Windows Virtual PC. All you need is a PC with Professional, Ultimate or Enterprise and you can use it. Or if you’re really an avid techie, use VMware Player or Workstation to host your line-of-business applications and solutions.

Another key solution is to ensure that your hardware is compatible, in XP Mode, you can use your existing hardware (whether it’s a printer, or other peripheral). Give free training to staff, show them how to use it, or point them to the right locations. Paul Thurott has a comprehensive set of guides on XP Mode, and Windows 7, and so do many others like Ed Bott and Mary Jo Foley.


The costs
Microsoft has several options for pricing and availablility for Windows 7, Office 2007, and later Office 2010. You can use Volume Licensing for deployment purposes and TechNet and even MSDN (with/without Visual Studio) for testing, development and deployment scenarios. In any case, there are options all affordable for any size institutions.


The Benefits
Sure, everyone always says that Security is a benefit for upgrading to the latest and greatest, but there’s more to it then that. Windows 7 not only makes your every-day tasks easier, but Windows 7 is also more efficient both in power, and program management. If that isn’t enough for you, Windows 7 provides the latest version of Internet Explorer (which is 8 as of the time of this writing), and the ability to utilize touch displays, and larger memory space (on x64 systems), larger Hard Disks, and of course a more stable and reliable Operating System.

Not to mention the fact that there’s a lot of opportunity to say that Windows 7 features the most advanced graphical system, and customization aspects. You can organize your life with Aero. Not only does the new superbar free up your cluttered space on your taskbar, it makes your life easier by presenting the applications you want within a single button.


</h4> <h4>Conclusion
While I most certainly do not make the final decision, it’s hard to believe, that in 2010 people are still using Windows XP. I mean Windows Vista raised the bar, but not high enough, Windows 7 made it even better. There’s a lot of potential here, and if Education doesn’t act soon, there won’t be any room for them in the future.



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[Ryan Price]

Quote

The Underlying Problem
While many tend to overlook the fact that some institutions have made some progress, it isn’t enough to say that it’s a statistic. Colleges seem to be on the right track, or so it seems, but when you look at K-12 schools, they still got a long way to go before they get where they need to be.

So what’s the problem? Cost is a major contributing factor. Granted, not every school district/county is rich, but if you’re going to have a “Technology of the future” program, please, do us a favor and do something about that.

You cant expect schools to upgrade when they aren't getting funding and have other priorities before new computers.

Quote

The Solution
While I don’t want to say overhaul your entire ecosystem, upgrading your PCs with new computers, or new-ish computers that support the latest and greatest is a good start. There is 1 solution that can help you transition from Windows XP to Windows Vista, and that’s XP Mode, which works in conjunction with Windows Virtual PC. All you need is a PC with Professional, Ultimate or Enterprise and you can use it. Or if you’re really an avid techie, use VMware Player or Workstation to host your line-of-business applications and solutions.

Most people outside the circle of tech junkies have no idea what vmware or virtual pc are and much less know how to even work XP Mode.


while the article is well written there's very 1 sides views of things and without going into much detail its basically saying shame on you for not upgrading.

[Sevan]

Ryan Price, on 23 March 2010 - 04:52 AM, said:

Quote

The Underlying Problem
While many tend to overlook the fact that some institutions have made some progress, it isn’t enough to say that it’s a statistic. Colleges seem to be on the right track, or so it seems, but when you look at K-12 schools, they still got a long way to go before they get where they need to be.

So what’s the problem? Cost is a major contributing factor. Granted, not every school district/county is rich, but if you’re going to have a “Technology of the future” program, please, do us a favor and do something about that.

You cant expect schools to upgrade when they aren't getting funding and have other priorities before new computers.

Quote

The Solution
While I don’t want to say overhaul your entire ecosystem, upgrading your PCs with new computers, or new-ish computers that support the latest and greatest is a good start. There is 1 solution that can help you transition from Windows XP to Windows Vista, and that’s XP Mode, which works in conjunction with Windows Virtual PC. All you need is a PC with Professional, Ultimate or Enterprise and you can use it. Or if you’re really an avid techie, use VMware Player or Workstation to host your line-of-business applications and solutions.

Most people outside the circle of tech junkies have no idea what vmware or virtual pc are and much less know how to even work XP Mode.


while the article is well written there's very 1 sides views of things and without going into much detail its basically saying shame on you for not upgrading.

I'm talking in the context of those who manage those PCs, the IT guys would know what those tools are, not necessarily what the teachers/ataff. While I do agree I did make the article one sided, there really isn't another side to the story is there?

[Loebl]

Well on our University there are most computers running on winXP, or dual-boot to some linux-distro (I think OpenSuse)
If they want to upgrade to Win7 they certainly need to upgrade the hardware as well, and the number of Computers isn't small.
Also the computers are mainly as access point to some uni services (mail for example) and therefore are sufficient for that task (A variety of browser is installed, like firefox and opera). And things that are sufficient get upgraded in the last moment.
Plus some computers use things like serial interfaces and I am sure modern computers don't have them anymore, so this would require additional hardware and doesn't lower the costs

So before an upgrade occurs there have to be some seriously strong arguments, other than superbar or a new office (besides there is always the linux alternative with OpenOffice. Or maybe Apple is also offering packages with hardware and software for schools or large companies)

[cheesepenguins]

You don't make very good arguments in this article, yes older tech but to be fair you don't need anything above XP to do what is in the curriculum of my old school. Plus it would be possible to use Linux on all the boxes for free save upgrade costs and let the budget go on other more useful items/facilities/staffing. Remember moving onto 7 after Xp does require newer hardware, factor this into your costs, let alone running Vmware on top of the newer system.

What you failed to do was give a good reason that 7 is needed?

[Sevan]

Loebl, on 23 March 2010 - 11:11 AM, said:

Well on our University there are most computers running on winXP, or dual-boot to some linux-distro (I think OpenSuse)
If they want to upgrade to Win7 they certainly need to upgrade the hardware as well, and the number of Computers isn't small.
Also the computers are mainly as access point to some uni services (mail for example) and therefore are sufficient for that task (A variety of browser is installed, like firefox and opera). And things that are sufficient get upgraded in the last moment.
Plus some computers use things like serial interfaces and I am sure modern computers don't have them anymore, so this would require additional hardware and doesn't lower the costs

So before an upgrade occurs there have to be some seriously strong arguments, other than superbar or a new office (besides there is always the linux alternative with OpenOffice. Or maybe Apple is also offering packages with hardware and software for schools or large companies)

Well, yeah. Additional hardware costs will be needed in most cases.

cheesepenguins, on 23 March 2010 - 12:41 PM, said:

You don't make very good arguments in this article, yes older tech but to be fair you don't need anything above XP to do what is in the curriculum of my old school. Plus it would be possible to use Linux on all the boxes for free save upgrade costs and let the budget go on other more useful items/facilities/staffing. Remember moving onto 7 after Xp does require newer hardware, factor this into your costs, let alone running Vmware on top of the newer system.

What you failed to do was give a good reason that 7 is needed?

Okay, let's put it this way. Windows XP was released in October 2001, it's now March 2010. XP support is going to end (theoretically) in April 2014, which gives schools 4 additional years before they seriously need to consider upgrading.

While my argument is based on the age of the OS and the experiences I've had with Windows 7, I think it's a good idea for people to move on, no matter what the cost is. I mean, how are educators going to say we're teaching kids about new technology when they're using old tech themselves, it contradicts its self. It makes no sense to have these programs for "Classrooms of the future" when none of that money is used to update the software on the systems, instead using Windows XP on modern systems released within the last 2-3 years.

[amon91]

Sevan, on 23 March 2010 - 03:39 PM, said:

While my argument is based on the age of the OS and the experiences I've had with Windows 7, I think it's a good idea for people to move on, no matter what the cost is. I mean, how are educators going to say we're teaching kids about new technology when they're using old tech themselves, it contradicts its self. It makes no sense to have these programs for "Classrooms of the future" when none of that money is used to update the software on the systems, instead using Windows XP on modern systems released within the last 2-3 years.

Well, sometimes their problem is if they want to spend money on upgrading they'll have to cut further back on far more important things like teachers and staff which definitely shouldn't be an option. And let's be honest here: XP, despite being old, outdated and definitely not pretty, it does the job well. Most software supports it, so it's not really a problem for most people who rely more on specific software than OS features. So let me get that out of the way.

That said, as Microsoft prepares to drop support for XP it might soon be time to move away from XP. My school has chosen to implement Ubuntu on most computers and is saving tons of money that way. It's been working pretty well for us so far.

[Floor]

I have no problem with my college using XP- as Amon said, it does the job well. However, what I do have a problem with is the continued use of IE6. Yep. We're still on that. I don't really need to go into why it needs to be changed, but even if they upgraded it to IE8 or even Firefox, then I'd be happy. The annoying thing is, I know for a fact all the IT technicians at our college use Win 7 and Firefox, I've seen it myself. the fact they've changed the OS and the browser for them and not for us is just downright selfish. They're a bunch of idiots.

[Eugene C]

Are you kidding me? That would be insanely expensive. The school board that's in charge of the school I currently attend is in charge of all the public schools in three cities. That's a lot of computers.

Even with the newer PCs at my school, thin, branded with shiny new Intel stickers, and equipped with spiffy thin Microsoft keyboards, they still run extremely slow after being loaded with the Novell school system that's used to keep us kids from doing anything harmful/not-educational.

I can't imagine how slow the PCs would be after installing 7 and Novell on top of that, along with using newer apps like Office 2007. Even Visual C# lags like crap on them as it is, along with Office 2003.

[Steven Doran]

Sevan, on 23 March 2010 - 03:39 PM, said:

cheesepenguins, on 23 March 2010 - 12:41 PM, said:

You don't make very good arguments in this article, yes older tech but to be fair you don't need anything above XP to do what is in the curriculum of my old school. Plus it would be possible to use Linux on all the boxes for free save upgrade costs and let the budget go on other more useful items/facilities/staffing. Remember moving onto 7 after Xp does require newer hardware, factor this into your costs, let alone running Vmware on top of the newer system.

What you failed to do was give a good reason that 7 is needed?

Okay, let's put it this way. Windows XP was released in October 2001, it's now March 2010. XP support is going to end (theoretically) in April 2014, which gives schools 4 additional years before they seriously need to consider upgrading.

While my argument is based on the age of the OS and the experiences I've had with Windows 7, I think it's a good idea for people to move on, no matter what the cost is. I mean, how are educators going to say we're teaching kids about new technology when they're using old tech themselves, it contradicts its self. It makes no sense to have these programs for "Classrooms of the future" when none of that money is used to update the software on the systems, instead using Windows XP on modern systems released within the last 2-3 years.

Windows XP and Windows 7 are essentially the same in terms of usability. Someone that's been using XP for years can easily get adjusted to Windows 7.

In my opinion, Windows 7 isn't a big enough upgrade to justify so much money being spent on upgrading all the software. I think the smartest move is for school districts to embrace Linux, it's perfect for education purposes, and more money can go towards paying for things that matter more, like doors for the bathroom stalls in my school.

[Eugene C]

Steven Doran, on 23 March 2010 - 09:56 PM, said:

Sevan, on 23 March 2010 - 03:39 PM, said:

cheesepenguins, on 23 March 2010 - 12:41 PM, said:

You don't make very good arguments in this article, yes older tech but to be fair you don't need anything above XP to do what is in the curriculum of my old school. Plus it would be possible to use Linux on all the boxes for free save upgrade costs and let the budget go on other more useful items/facilities/staffing. Remember moving onto 7 after Xp does require newer hardware, factor this into your costs, let alone running Vmware on top of the newer system.

What you failed to do was give a good reason that 7 is needed?

Okay, let's put it this way. Windows XP was released in October 2001, it's now March 2010. XP support is going to end (theoretically) in April 2014, which gives schools 4 additional years before they seriously need to consider upgrading.

While my argument is based on the age of the OS and the experiences I've had with Windows 7, I think it's a good idea for people to move on, no matter what the cost is. I mean, how are educators going to say we're teaching kids about new technology when they're using old tech themselves, it contradicts its self. It makes no sense to have these programs for "Classrooms of the future" when none of that money is used to update the software on the systems, instead using Windows XP on modern systems released within the last 2-3 years.

Windows XP and Windows 7 are essentially the same in terms of usability. Someone that's been using XP for years can easily get adjusted to Windows 7.

In my opinion, Windows 7 isn't a big enough upgrade to justify so much money being spent on upgrading all the software. I think the smartest move is for school districts to embrace Linux, it's perfect for education purposes, and more money can go towards paying for things that matter more, like doors for the bathroom stalls in my school.

We have a lab of computers with Linux on them, and I hate using them.

[pm_41]

Good news everyone! My school is supposedly getting Windows 7 this summer!

[c0lin]

My old high school only had Apple computers. No PCs at all.

[Sevan]

pm_41, on 23 March 2010 - 11:04 PM, said:

Good news everyone! My school is supposedly getting Windows 7 this summer!

Yay!

c0lin, on 24 March 2010 - 01:05 AM, said:

My old high school only had Apple computers. No PCs at all.

Macs aren't as big an issue as Windows is. I mean the changes between machines is few and far, at least you don't have spec inconsistencies with different Macs and the Operating System.

[cheesepenguins]

The argument of teaching technology of the future is bollocks, name a program that can run on 7 and not on XP that is used in an educational environment?

I don't know about your school but I was never taught anything about the OS on the machines I used to learn about basic programming constructs etc whilst at school.

[peacho]

Sevan, on 23 March 2010 - 06:58 AM, said:

I'm talking in the context of those who manage those PCs, the IT guys would know what those tools are, not necessarily what the teachers/ataff. While I do agree I did make the article one sided, there really isn't another side to the story is there?

Ooh, bad call. Editorials, yes, are almost always one-sided, but there's always more than one side of the story. I think replies here have justified that.

Steven Doran, on 23 March 2010 - 09:56 PM, said:

Sevan, on 23 March 2010 - 03:39 PM, said:

cheesepenguins, on 23 March 2010 - 12:41 PM, said:

You don't make very good arguments in this article, yes older tech but to be fair you don't need anything above XP to do what is in the curriculum of my old school. Plus it would be possible to use Linux on all the boxes for free save upgrade costs and let the budget go on other more useful items/facilities/staffing. Remember moving onto 7 after Xp does require newer hardware, factor this into your costs, let alone running Vmware on top of the newer system.

What you failed to do was give a good reason that 7 is needed?

Okay, let's put it this way. Windows XP was released in October 2001, it's now March 2010. XP support is going to end (theoretically) in April 2014, which gives schools 4 additional years before they seriously need to consider upgrading.

While my argument is based on the age of the OS and the experiences I've had with Windows 7, I think it's a good idea for people to move on, no matter what the cost is. I mean, how are educators going to say we're teaching kids about new technology when they're using old tech themselves, it contradicts its self. It makes no sense to have these programs for "Classrooms of the future" when none of that money is used to update the software on the systems, instead using Windows XP on modern systems released within the last 2-3 years.

Windows XP and Windows 7 are essentially the same in terms of usability. Someone that's been using XP for years can easily get adjusted to Windows 7.

In my opinion, Windows 7 isn't a big enough upgrade to justify so much money being spent on upgrading all the software. I think the smartest move is for school districts to embrace Linux, it's perfect for education purposes, and more money can go towards paying for things that matter more, like doors for the bathroom stalls in my school.

Interesting you (Steven) say that "someone that's been using XP for years can easily get adjusted to Windows 7," as that actually helps to justify an upgrade by saying it doesn't require as much training.

Unfortunately, I'm not sure there will ever be an OS worth upgrading to. What will make OSes worth upgrading to? Most likely a lack of support from the schools' support services.

Iian, while your article was indeed well written, it seemed to miss how school IT departments generally work (or at least mine). It's kinda irrelevant how they get the software - that's likely already worked out. And it's a school, so they're going to be using likely the Enterprise edition, so it's not really worth saying which SKUs are needed to get XP Mode. I just felt like the article was not angled correctly.

Here's how our school is: Each student receives a brand new laptop their sophomore year. It is used for three years, and then once they graduate, it is cycled through other schools (for a few more years). Software or hardware-wise, there's nothing preventing (to my knowledge) an upgrade to Windows 7. We use Office 2007, a new version of Novell's ZenWorks (which I'm almost certain works on newer systems). I can't really think of any software which would even require virtualization. My laptop (I'm a senior) has a Core 2 Duo somethingorother and a gig of RAM. The junior and sophomore laptops are HP Minis, which are actually licensed for Windows Vista Business.

What's the holdup? Testing deployment. Sure Windows 7 may be great, but even if the software is compatible, updating the probably 2500 computers across the district would require immense testing and even then, there would be huge problems. I can tell you I doubt our school will update for another few years. This year we got a new Server (I believe running Windows Server 2008), upgraded to Office 2007 (without much troubles it seems), got a new version of ZenWorks, a new web filter and have more and more teachers using Promethean boards (like Smart Boards). There were obviously some problems. Specifically, our new Internet filter software uses a whitelist, so it took a while to get actually useful Internet access at the beginning of the year. Also, (according to my friend, who did some snooping), the logon script was something like 13000 lines long, so it took over 5 minutes sitting at "Preparing Network Connections" to work.

I will say that having worked in different media aspects, newer would be much better. I was spoiled this summer on a newspaper staff at Indiana University using new computers with 4GB of RAM on Windows Vista and Adobe CS4. Everything worked like a charm. Come back home and we installed CS4 on 5 year old computers with the "fastest" one having some strange amount of RAM near 768MB. Good luck having Photoshop, InDesign and Word all open at the same time. We also have some 2006-era Media Center PCs in the broadcast and video production classes, which have some varying hardware issues. But hey, it's better than trying to run Sony Vegas on a freaking netbook. Oh yeah, there's also some 2008 iMacs in there - usually very little trouble with those (they seem to get more reliable, not less ).

So would I like to see a total upgrade? Definitely. Do I think it will happen within the next 36 months? I'm leaning towards no.

[Eugene C]

@Peacho: (not going to quote that much stuff, this reply would be too big)

Ouch, that's a pretty bad logon script you got there. My school board uses ZenWorks too, and we barely see that window. The newer computers at my school either have Pentiums or Core 2 Duos and 2GB of RAM, but are still considerably slow due to ZenWorks. We do have several CS4 apps, though they're a bit laggy, though nowhere as near as slow as running them on the older PCs. The servers at my school actually have Office 2003 installed on the, but they never put the shortcuts into the main My Applications window, as the apps generally slow down the computers, even though they have 2GB of RAM and decent processors.

A lot of applications we use are old too, mainly programs used by the Tech department, as they're older programs that simply don't exist anymore, but that can't be helped. I highly doubt these Windows 95-era programs would run properly in Windows 7, but I'm sure something could be arranged to replace it.

And God knows how terrible everything was when we upgraded to Windows XP from Windows 95 only four years ago...

[peacho]

Eugene C, on 26 March 2010 - 01:35 AM, said:

And God knows how terrible everything was when we upgraded to Windows XP from Windows 95 only four years ago...

That's a big ouch. AFAIK, we've been using Windows XP since at least 2004.

[Ryan Price]

Quote

While my argument is based on the age of the OS and the experiences I've had with Windows 7, I think it's a good idea for people to move on, no matter what the cost is. I mean, how are educators going to say we're teaching kids about new technology when they're using old tech themselves, it contradicts its self. It makes no sense to have these programs for "Classrooms of the future" when none of that money is used to update the software on the systems, instead using Windows XP on modern systems released within the last 2-3 years.

Regardless of your experience with Windows 7 have you actually tried rolling it out in an enterprise environment? Or testing your home brewed applications to make sure they work right on it? How bout other applications that might not be Windows 7 ready? Regardless if you think it's a good idea for people to move right on along. You failed to mention - cost to the organization, the time and money it takes to make sure an implementation of a new OS goes smoothly. Personally i worked in that type of environment and we still ran Windows Server 2003 R2 Enterprise and Windows XP Professional SP3. It's best to do a new OS implementation when you do a hardware refresh of your environment. When we started phasing out Windows 2000 Machines they were replaced with XP. Maybe you see it this way because you haven't been exposed to an enterprise environment or an infrastructure that has a large user base.

Quote

Iian, while your article was indeed well written, it seemed to miss how school IT departments generally work (or at least mine). It's kinda irrelevant how they get the software - that's likely already worked out. And it's a school, so they're going to be using likely the Enterprise edition, so it's not really worth saying which SKUs are needed to get XP Mode. I just felt like the article was not angled correctly.

It was well written i will give him that, but like your IT environment mine was the same, another major scare why we didn't bother exploring Windows Vista was their new licensing scheme which would have honestly cause us more if we had thought the same way you did and just flipped everything over to vista or 7. You have worry about KSM server's to authenticate product licenses in big environments, and that was something you didn't have to worry about under XP.

Quote

how are educators going to say we're teaching kids about new technology when they're using old tech themselves, it contradicts its self. It makes no sense to have these programs for "Classrooms of the future" when none of that money is used to update the software on the systems, instead using Windows XP on modern systems released within the last 2-3 years.

Because the educators don't know any better which is why they have IT that's in charge of their technology needs not them. Compared to some classrooms that don't even have that, simply having a computer and access to the web opens up a very large learning system for kids who might not otherwise have it in an environment without computers.